Another IMA guy’s take on BJJ

The following is a quote from dragonprawn in this post over at EF. He made some great points that I would like to expound on after the quote.

Shane, Meynard and others got on me some years ago when I started a thread on Tim’s Shen Wu site called “Is Ground Training Necessary?” or some such. But after some debate I was a man of my word and went down to my local BJJ school to see for myself. The people there were extremely skilled, super cool and honestly trying to solve “the fundamental problem of the MAs” from my experience. However, there was some tremendous downside.
 
First, I was about 40-years-old rolling with mostly 20 and 30 somethings. It seemed every one of my randori partners had horrendous injuries from the BJJ and no practice that they used to fix themselves up again like a good IMA guy would.For example, one dude (could not have been 25) when working with me on cervical submissions asked me to take it easy as he had three ruptured vertebrae in his neck. I asked how that happened and he said BJJ. Had another dude left my TCC school to switch to BJJ – broken clavicle right away. And I found one asshole who didn’t respect the tap the day we were doing knee submissions! I almost lost my composure with him. 
 
…

 Anyway I did realize that in their favor grappling stamina was quite a bit different than boxing stamina (sometimes I’d let them arm bar me just so I could get a drink of Gatorade). But at the same time I began to think that after the basics you are only learning grappling to grapple other grapplers (if that makes sense). Bottom line I found most of it very sportive in naturecompared to my combat tai chi steel/cotton dragonprawn boxing which is far more street practical. The BJJ guys were very addicted to it though so there was no converting them.
 
Then to top it off I watched a Pride fight of my BJJ teacher. As he closed in to take the opponent down and grapple him like the python he is the guy gives him a good ol’ uppercut to the jaw on his way in and he looked like those Looney Toon cartoons were they say “Which way did he go, which way did he go?” before hitting the canvas lights out. More or less supporting my original hypothesis I might add. (earlier, dragonprawn had said that IMA students should spend more time learning to get up quickly rather than spend time learning to groundfight.)

The part about horrendous injuries is something that I’ve noticed as well. Most people who pursue BJJ seriously get injured fairly regularly it seems. It is a fighting based art, afterall, and injuries are just part of the territory. I saw a few people get injured and I heard about others in the school that got hurt pretty bad. I know of other people who just quit the practice because other students were too aggressive and wouldn’t tap out even if they were in an impossible position. Others would crank up the tension too quickly so that the joints were damaged before students could even tap. That kind of stuff is not cool and if you train BJJ, you have to be on constant watch for it. Still, every MA has it’s risks!

But the bigger point that dragonprawn brings up is that BJJ has no healing side to it at all. It’s fighting and that’s it, but then many MA’s don’t have healing practices. Still, attitudes about MA and healing have something to do with the mindset of the practitioners. IMO, most of the people attracted to BJJ are going to be young men in their teens, twenties, and thirties. Maybe a few women or men in their 40’s or above will be interested, but they would be the exception IMO. So the mindset of the “invincibility of youth” would be quite strong in most BJJ schools I would imagine. This does show up in the attitude a bit from my experience.   

The fact that MA can have a healing component doesn’t enter into the BJJ mindset at all, and that’s too bad. IMA does a fairly good job with healing the body IF people are taught how to use it that way, a caveat that rules most people out I’m afraid.

But this problem with the BJJ mindset isn’t all their fault, the fault also lies with people who run around talking about IMA for health but they or their teachers weigh 300 lbs, etc. When IMA students talk about health and healing but they aren’t healthy themselves, then they just end up looking like fools. Who could blame people for being skeptical? If you talk about healing and health, then is it too much for your body to show SOME evidence of it?  

Second, his point about grappling other grapplers and the sportive nature of most schools is a good one. Like all MA’s, BJJ specializes and BJJ students spend most of their time grappling with other people who are interested in BJJ. That just makes sense. But it does show a bit of a limitation. How other BJJ students react to the techniques gets ingrained as you hone your reactions against them. If you’re not looking to pursue BJJ itself, then getting the basics down may be enough for you.

I also agree that some schools eventually become sportive in nature. BJJ sport competitions are a natural part of the game for some students who get into BJJ. Why wouldn’t it be? Competing can bring out the best in you. Students who are willing to get out there and put their heart and soul into the training deserve extra training from the teacher. We all want serious students, don’t we? And from a teacher’s POV, there’s no better advertising than students that win competitions. It’s proof positive that you not only have the goods yourself, but that you can teach them to other people. So the attraction of competition shouldn’t be ignored or easily brushed off.

And yet, competition can become the sole focus of some schools. The self-defense side of BJJ can get ignored in the rush to victory. Schools that used to attract many different students from all walks of life can become fight/competition clubs that only attract those willing to compete. That’s too bad. BJJ has a lot to offer everyone.

Finally, his comment about learning to get up instead of fighting on the ground is one that should be taken seriously. Part of the problem with the sport BJJ mindset is laying on the ground in the guard position waiting for your opponent to attack. Unfortunately, you can see this in too many of the fights the Gracies are involved in. They dominate on the ground so they lazily lay there until the opponent figures out a way in. Sure, it may win competitions but it’s not a smart thing to get used to considering what might happen in a self-defense situation.  

All-in-all, I found dragonprawn’s comments to be quite interesting.